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    NickSINYC
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by NickSINYC on Thu 15 Jan 2015 - 18:19


    I think it would make a lot of fans happy but I don't see him slipping to 6.

    Even though I am not high on Fitzpatrick with Gailey in charge and Fitz there to start while Geno and Mario start their grooming we may have a bright future.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by NYJETSDAN16 on Thu 15 Jan 2015 - 22:25

    NickSINYC wrote:
    NYJETSDAN16 wrote:This Brandon Bridge kid has a gun and very athletic. Diamond in the rough.


    I like his size and arm strength but under 52% on completions is rough.


    I think with the right tuteledge Nick, he can be a stud in this league.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by NYJETSDAN16 on Thu 15 Jan 2015 - 22:27

    cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers
    NickSINYC wrote:

    I think it would make a lot of fans happy but I don't see him slipping to 6.

    Even though I am not high on Fitzpatrick with Gailey in charge and Fitz there to start while Geno and Mario start their grooming we may have a bright future.


    cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by SackExchange on Thu 15 Jan 2015 - 22:59

    NickSINYC wrote:

    I think it would make a lot of fans happy but I don't see him slipping to 6.

    Even though I am not high on Fitzpatrick with Gailey in charge and Fitz there to start while Geno and Mario start their grooming we may have a bright future.
    If Mariota made it to #6, I would be ecstatic.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by GratefulJet on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 0:45

    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Sarge wrote:You know, I think a lot of that discussion is sort of moot anymore.  NFL teams play so many sub packages and there are players of all shapes and sizes playing all different spots nowadays.  Teams are rarely in a base 4-3 or 3-4 now.  Sheldon Richardson isn't really a classic 3-4 DT or DE, but he's awesome. Clay Matthews played middke linebacker for Green Bay. Elvis Dumerville doesnt have a position in the classic NFL model....Ray is a playmaker and could be used in a lot of ways.

    I'm just trying to figure out which of our other 1st round DL picks is going to sent to the sideline when we put this guy on the field.

    the one that wasnt a 1st rd pick, Harrison.

    ...and how worried are you really about him stealing Babin's PT? Twisted Evil  
    Actually, I hope they cut Babin. Don't like him at all. However, the marginal utility of drafting Ray to replace Snacks does not justify spending the #6 overall pick. Harrison is the one good value we have on the DL. Pissing that asset away just so we can field 4 first round picks on our DL only further concentrates our strengths in one area and leaves us lacking elite players elsewhere on the field. That strikes me as a really bad strategic move. I'm sure Ray is a better pass rusher than Harrison, but we will lose some stoutness against the run in that tradeoff, and in general we are too DE-heavy along the DL if we field a line of Ray/Wilkerson/Coples/Richardson.

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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Old#15 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 0:59

    I would rather have a playmaker at OLB like Thompson, who would really put some much needed athleticism and playmaking ability on the outside of the LB corps, particularly if we go to the 4-3.

    I think we are going to be faced with some unexpected, interesting and very tempting options at #6 . It wouldn't shock me if one of the two QBs or Amari Cooper is sitting there when our turn comes up. To be honest I hope it doesn't happen because both QBs are flawed and green, and we have bigger needs than WR to invest a premium pick.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by GratefulJet on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 1:05

    I think OLB and even MLB will be a much bigger need than DL, if Babin and especially if Harris isn't brought back. Beasley and Thompson make a lot more sense in that respect. I would go in that direction or OL.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Superman55 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 7:08

    GratefulJet wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Sarge wrote:You know, I think a lot of that discussion is sort of moot anymore.  NFL teams play so many sub packages and there are players of all shapes and sizes playing all different spots nowadays.  Teams are rarely in a base 4-3 or 3-4 now.  Sheldon Richardson isn't really a classic 3-4 DT or DE, but he's awesome. Clay Matthews played middke linebacker for Green Bay. Elvis Dumerville doesnt have a position in the classic NFL model....Ray is a playmaker and could be used in a lot of ways.

    I'm just trying to figure out which of our other 1st round DL picks is going to sent to the sideline when we put this guy on the field.

    the one that wasnt a 1st rd pick, Harrison.

    ...and how worried are you really about him stealing Babin's PT? Twisted Evil  
    Actually, I hope they cut Babin. Don't like him at all. However, the marginal utility of drafting Ray to replace Snacks does not justify spending the #6 overall pick. Harrison is the one good value we have on the DL. Pissing that asset away just so we can field 4 first round picks on our DL only further concentrates our strengths in one area and leaves us lacking elite players elsewhere on the field. That strikes me as a really bad strategic move. I'm sure Ray is a better pass rusher than Harrison, but we will lose some stoutness against the run in that tradeoff, and in general we are too DE-heavy along the DL if we field a line of Ray/Wilkerson/Coples/Richardson.

    Well, since teams play nickel defense over 60% of the time, snacks already only plays ~40 % of the time anyway. Ray would obviously be drafted to replace Pace long term, but I would expect him to be a pass rushing specialist initially. The same will be true for Beasely or any other OLB that goes rd 1.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Seaver on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 9:30

    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Sarge wrote:You know, I think a lot of that discussion is sort of moot anymore.  NFL teams play so many sub packages and there are players of all shapes and sizes playing all different spots nowadays.  Teams are rarely in a base 4-3 or 3-4 now.  Sheldon Richardson isn't really a classic 3-4 DT or DE, but he's awesome. Clay Matthews played middke linebacker for Green Bay. Elvis Dumerville doesnt have a position in the classic NFL model....Ray is a playmaker and could be used in a lot of ways.

    I'm just trying to figure out which of our other 1st round DL picks is going to sent to the sideline when we put this guy on the field.

    the one that wasnt a 1st rd pick, Harrison.

    ...and how worried are you really about him stealing Babin's PT? Twisted Evil  
    Actually, I hope they cut Babin. Don't like him at all. However, the marginal utility of drafting Ray to replace Snacks does not justify spending the #6 overall pick. Harrison is the one good value we have on the DL. Pissing that asset away just so we can field 4 first round picks on our DL only further concentrates our strengths in one area and leaves us lacking elite players elsewhere on the field. That strikes me as a really bad strategic move. I'm sure Ray is a better pass rusher than Harrison, but we will lose some stoutness against the run in that tradeoff, and in general we are too DE-heavy along the DL if we field a line of Ray/Wilkerson/Coples/Richardson.

    Well, since teams play nickel defense over 60% of the time, snacks already only plays ~40 % of the time anyway. Ray would obviously be drafted to replace Pace long term, but I would expect him to be a pass rushing specialist initially.  The same will be true for Beasely or any other OLB that goes rd 1.

    isn't Ray the one with the scouting report stating he doesn't have much in the way of pass rush moves?
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Superman55 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 9:49

    Seaver wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Sarge wrote:You know, I think a lot of that discussion is sort of moot anymore.  NFL teams play so many sub packages and there are players of all shapes and sizes playing all different spots nowadays.  Teams are rarely in a base 4-3 or 3-4 now.  Sheldon Richardson isn't really a classic 3-4 DT or DE, but he's awesome. Clay Matthews played middke linebacker for Green Bay. Elvis Dumerville doesnt have a position in the classic NFL model....Ray is a playmaker and could be used in a lot of ways.

    I'm just trying to figure out which of our other 1st round DL picks is going to sent to the sideline when we put this guy on the field.

    the one that wasnt a 1st rd pick, Harrison.

    ...and how worried are you really about him stealing Babin's PT? Twisted Evil  
    Actually, I hope they cut Babin. Don't like him at all. However, the marginal utility of drafting Ray to replace Snacks does not justify spending the #6 overall pick. Harrison is the one good value we have on the DL. Pissing that asset away just so we can field 4 first round picks on our DL only further concentrates our strengths in one area and leaves us lacking elite players elsewhere on the field. That strikes me as a really bad strategic move. I'm sure Ray is a better pass rusher than Harrison, but we will lose some stoutness against the run in that tradeoff, and in general we are too DE-heavy along the DL if we field a line of Ray/Wilkerson/Coples/Richardson.

    Well, since teams play nickel defense over 60% of the time, snacks already only plays ~40 % of the time anyway. Ray would obviously be drafted to replace Pace long term, but I would expect him to be a pass rushing specialist initially.  The same will be true for Beasely or any other OLB that goes rd 1.

    isn't Ray the one with the scouting report stating he doesn't have much in the way of pass rush moves?  

    Seaver:  This is a fair scouting report of him:

    http://firstroundgrade.com/2014/12/10/scouting-the-des-shane-ray-missouri/

    And in all honesty, the Aaron Maybin comparison isn't "crazy," because both were only full time starters 1 year in college...but Maybe played at 225 in college while Ray played at 245.  Ray is a bigger player than Maybin or Mingo were in college.  Mingo is actually used as the Browns coverage LB on TEs for the Browns (7 career sacks in 2 years to date), and I think Ray is slightly bigger than those 2 and will be a players that is sideline to sideline and can be coverage or pass rushing capable day 1.

    He will need to add weight and workhard; but again, I think teaming him up with Richardson will lead to his success as former college teammates.   I really like that pairing and them pushing eachother...Mingo and Maybin did not have that mentor (though I still think Mingo will be a nice player compared to Maybin).

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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by hobson54 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 10:01

    i wouldn't be surprised to see a 2nd WR after cooper work his way up into the conversation for a top 10 pick, or even higher. obviously what we do in free agency will have an impact on which direction we go to some degree.

    as to ray, there's no way we should let snacks go to take a rush end. we need to keep all 3 of snacks, mo and richardson and build around them. in any event, the point will be moot (i.e. a trade-off of one for the other) since we will know before the draft whether snacks is retained (or at least gets a high tender) or not. i think a smart defensive coach like bowles knows talent when he sees it, and you don't let talent like that walk out the door without a fight.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Superman55 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 10:08

    hobson54 wrote:i wouldn't be surprised to see a 2nd WR after cooper work his way up into the conversation for a top 10 pick, or even higher.  obviously what we do in free agency will have an impact on which direction we go to some degree.

    as to ray, there's no way we should let snacks go to take a rush end.  we need to keep all 3 of snacks, mo and richardson and build around them.  in any event, the point will be moot (i.e. a trade-off of one for the other) since we will know before the draft whether snacks is retained (or at least gets a high tender) or not.  i think a smart defensive coach like bowles knows talent when he sees it, and you don't let talent like that walk out the door without a fight.

    I wasn't saying that.  I was saying in pass rush downs or nickel/dime packages, Wilkerson shifts inside, richardson and coples outside with their hands in the dirt (technically Richardson always has his hand in the dirt), and David Harris and Snacks come "off the field" for a nickel DB and Ray...
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Sarge on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 10:25

    The "problem" we're going to have in the draft is the same "problem" we had in the coaching search - the top prospects on the board will likely be defensive players. Just like the top coaching prospects were defensive coaches. The Jets went with the bests available coach and I'm sure they will go with the best available player. If Cooper or Mariotta are sitting there, okay, it's a no brainer, but it's very possible the top 7 available prospects when the Jets draft will be in some order:

    Shane Ray DE/LB
    Vic Beasley LB
    Landon Collins S
    Shaq Thompson LB
    Alvin Dupree DE
    Brandon Scherrf OL
    WR #2 (Parker or White)

    If we think Sherff is a stud, then he is a viable option, otherwise it might be a top player at a non need position

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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Seaver on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 10:59

    Superman55 wrote:
    Seaver wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    GratefulJet wrote:
    Sarge wrote:You know, I think a lot of that discussion is sort of moot anymore.  NFL teams play so many sub packages and there are players of all shapes and sizes playing all different spots nowadays.  Teams are rarely in a base 4-3 or 3-4 now.  Sheldon Richardson isn't really a classic 3-4 DT or DE, but he's awesome. Clay Matthews played middke linebacker for Green Bay. Elvis Dumerville doesnt have a position in the classic NFL model....Ray is a playmaker and could be used in a lot of ways.

    I'm just trying to figure out which of our other 1st round DL picks is going to sent to the sideline when we put this guy on the field.

    the one that wasnt a 1st rd pick, Harrison.

    ...and how worried are you really about him stealing Babin's PT? Twisted Evil  
    Actually, I hope they cut Babin. Don't like him at all. However, the marginal utility of drafting Ray to replace Snacks does not justify spending the #6 overall pick. Harrison is the one good value we have on the DL. Pissing that asset away just so we can field 4 first round picks on our DL only further concentrates our strengths in one area and leaves us lacking elite players elsewhere on the field. That strikes me as a really bad strategic move. I'm sure Ray is a better pass rusher than Harrison, but we will lose some stoutness against the run in that tradeoff, and in general we are too DE-heavy along the DL if we field a line of Ray/Wilkerson/Coples/Richardson.

    Well, since teams play nickel defense over 60% of the time, snacks already only plays ~40 % of the time anyway. Ray would obviously be drafted to replace Pace long term, but I would expect him to be a pass rushing specialist initially.  The same will be true for Beasely or any other OLB that goes rd 1.

    isn't Ray the one with the scouting report stating he doesn't have much in the way of pass rush moves?  

    Seaver:  This is a fair scouting report of him:

    http://firstroundgrade.com/2014/12/10/scouting-the-des-shane-ray-missouri/

    And in all honesty, the Aaron Maybin comparison isn't "crazy," because both were only full time starters 1 year in college...but Maybe played at 225 in college while Ray played at 245.  Ray is a bigger player than Maybin or Mingo were in college.  Mingo is actually used as the Browns coverage LB on TEs for the Browns (7 career sacks in 2 years to date), and I think Ray is slightly bigger than those 2 and will be a players that is sideline to sideline and can be coverage or pass rushing capable day 1.

    He will need to add weight and workhard; but again, I think teaming him up with Richardson will lead to his success as former college teammates.   I really like that pairing and them pushing eachother...Mingo and Maybin did not have that mentor (though I still think Mingo will be a nice player compared to Maybin).

    LOL.....didn't know they mentioned Maybin..........but that is funny. Would anyone spend a #6 on Jason Babin? Reading between the lines on both scouting reports, there are doubts about his lower half holding up at the next level.......making one think he might be situational at best. Bruce Irvin also comes to mind. I don't see #6 overall in this guy Ray. Now maybe if they trade down to the middle of 1st round, but somebody else might overvalue him by then.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Superman55 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 11:01

    Sarge wrote:The "problem" we're going to have in the draft is the same "problem" we had in the coaching search - the top prospects on the board will likely be defensive players.  Just like the top coaching prospects were defensive coaches.  The Jets went with the bests available coach and I'm sure they will go with the best available player.  If Cooper or Mariotta are sitting there, okay, it's a no brainer, but it's very possible the top 7 available prospects when the Jets draft will be in some order:

    Shane Ray DE/LB
    Vic Beasley LB
    Landon Collins S
    Shaq Thompson LB
    Alvin Dupree  DE
    Brandon Scherrf OL
    WR #2 (Parker or White)

    If we think Sherff is a stud, then he is a viable option, otherwise it might be a top player at a non need position


    I think this is most likely, but wont be shocked if one of the QBs falls to us. I think there is a strong possibility we get offers to move down.

    Also 100% agree on White or Parker (I think Hobson or someone else said it earlier).

    When you're talking about 6'3+ WRs that productive in college, if one of them runs 4.3ish, or wows with the ability to bench 225 20 times (i.e. can get off press coverage)...or both...teams will be all over that guy as a top 10 prospect. Especially the way 2014 WRs stepped right in and performed...most college WRs struggle as rookies, but that trend is ending...now it is college QBs that can play that are impossible to find...

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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by cysporsche on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 11:10

    ESPN latest mock has Gregory 6'6"/235 going to the Raiders @ #4 with Cooper WR 6'1"/210 falling to the Jets @ #6.

    With Jack DelRio the Raiders new defensive minded HC, I'd bet he targets Suh for their DL and Gregory to play OLB opposite Mack. That would improve the Raiders 30th ranked defense in hurry with those two moves.

    Go Jets...Cyborg
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Seaver on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 11:12

    cysporsche wrote:ESPN latest mock has Gregory 6'6"/235 going to the Raiders @ #4 with Cooper WR 6'1"/210 falling to the Jets @ #6.

    With Jack DelRio the Raiders new defensive minded HC, I'd bet he targets Suh for their DL and Gregory to play OLB opposite Mack. That would improve the Raiders 30th ranked defense in hurry with those two moves.

    Go Jets...Cyborg

    can't argue that logic, but the flip side is they have their franchise QB with pedestrian WRs. Raiders really hold the direction of the draft.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by SackExchange on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 11:42

    Seaver wrote:
    cysporsche wrote:ESPN latest mock has Gregory 6'6"/235 going to the Raiders @ #4 with Cooper WR 6'1"/210 falling to the Jets @ #6.

    With Jack DelRio the Raiders new defensive minded HC, I'd bet he targets Suh for their DL and Gregory to play OLB opposite Mack. That would improve the Raiders 30th ranked defense in hurry with those two moves.

    Go Jets...Cyborg

    can't argue that logic, but the flip side is they have their franchise QB with pedestrian WRs.  Raiders really hold the direction of the draft.
    Good point. They do have their QB, or at least are committed to their QB unless and until he demonstrates otherwise. The Raiders are a bit of a lynchpin in this whole draft.

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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by cysporsche on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 12:22

    Jack Del Rio is a great hire by the Raiders, they will improve on his watch.

    Go Jets...Cyborg
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by football51 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 14:22

    Ian Rapoport retweeted
    Troy Vincent @TroyVincent23 · 1h 1 hour ago
    Underclassmen declaring early down 20% from 2014. We're succeeding in our emphasis on informed decisions.

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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by cysporsche on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 14:53

    Football51 & Jetman55 / Superman55, I appreciate all your "tweet updates", but sometimes they look like they are in code ? By the time you copy & paste, can you type out the message ? If not that's cool, just asking ?

    Go Jets...Cyborg
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by SackExchange on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 14:57

    In code?
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by football51 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 14:59

    SackExchange wrote:In code?



    I'm glad you asked that. I didn't understand Very Happy .
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Superman55 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 15:25

    cysporsche wrote:ESPN latest mock has Gregory 6'6"/235 going to the Raiders @ #4 with Cooper WR 6'1"/210 falling to the Jets @ #6.

    With Jack DelRio the Raiders new defensive minded HC, I'd bet he targets Suh for their DL and Gregory to play OLB opposite Mack. That would improve the Raiders 30th ranked defense in hurry with those two moves.

    Go Jets...Cyborg

    If that happens, I will watch a lot of Raiders games next year. Mack and Sammy were my two favorite players in last year's draft.
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    Re: 2015 NFL Draft Thread

    Post by Superman55 on Fri 16 Jan 2015 - 15:29

    cysporsche wrote:Football51 & Jetman55 / Superman55,  I appreciate all your "tweet updates", but sometimes they look like they are in code ? By the time you copy & paste, can you type out the message ? If not that's cool, just asking ?

    Go Jets...Cyborg

    I can clean mine up. There's some pieces when i copy paste Im too lazy to remove. Ill remove them. It happens all the time when I do two articles together so I started doing one at a time for the most part.

    51 - I think its the author/comments sections in the articles that do not format well when you copy paste articles/stories.

    It happens bad with rotoworld/ESPN Insider. I havent seen it as much with the tweets unless its the hashtags.

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