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    Post by SackExchange on Sat 18 Oct 2014 - 13:33

    NYJETSDAN16 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:Not sure how anyone pins last night's loss on Geno, unless they are looking for reasons to bash him.

    I just felt like we had opportunities in the red zone to win the Pats game. Geno, I will admit because it's true, played very well.  Yet I feel he needs a good ground game in order to do so.  If the run game isn't there then I feel it is too much for him to handle.

    The argument before the Harvin trade is that he had no weapons. IMHO, if the run game isn't working, Geno now has a monster home run athlete as he did at WV to count on to utilize.  There are no more excuses for having lack of talent.

    These next 9 games will be telling if he will be making a case for the 2015 campaign. I strongly feel having the playmakers around him will allow him to reach the next level.  
    Now it's time to make that a reality.

    As bad as Geno has been this season, we were still in all the games except one. Those matches could have been won if we would have converted our FG's into TD's.  Having a beast like Harvin can correct those issues and help Geno in his maturity.

    It's time for Geno to begin to turn heads and state that he belongs. From inside the organization to the fan base.
    I agree, and I want him to have a fair shot for the rest of the season. He can't be bashed when he plays relatively well. Fans can't call for him to be benched.

    At this point, there is NO reason to put in Vick. The rest of this year should be about Geno evaluation, and getting the weapons to click.
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    Post by NYJETSDAN16 on Sat 18 Oct 2014 - 14:27

    SackExchange wrote:
    NYJETSDAN16 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:Not sure how anyone pins last night's loss on Geno, unless they are looking for reasons to bash him.

    I just felt like we had opportunities in the red zone to win the Pats game. Geno, I will admit because it's true, played very well.  Yet I feel he needs a good ground game in order to do so.  If the run game isn't there then I feel it is too much for him to handle.

    The argument before the Harvin trade is that he had no weapons. IMHO, if the run game isn't working, Geno now has a monster home run athlete as he did at WV to count on to utilize.  There are no more excuses for having lack of talent.

    These next 9 games will be telling if he will be making a case for the 2015 campaign. I strongly feel having the playmakers around him will allow him to reach the next level.  
    Now it's time to make that a reality.

    As bad as Geno has been this season, we were still in all the games except one. Those matches could have been won if we would have converted our FG's into TD's.  Having a beast like Harvin can correct those issues and help Geno in his maturity.

    It's time for Geno to begin to turn heads and state that he belongs. From inside the organization to the fan base.
    I agree, and I want him to have a fair shot for the rest of the season. He can't be bashed when he plays relatively well. Fans can't call for him to be benched.

    At this point, there is NO reason to put in Vick. The rest of this year should be about Geno evaluation, and getting the weapons to click.

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    Post by jamesfyo123 on Sat 18 Oct 2014 - 14:50

    If it becomes apparent over the next 9 games that Geno is not the answer, I REALLY hope that Hoyer doesn't sign an extension in Cleveland.
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    Post by soj on Sat 18 Oct 2014 - 15:09

    SackExchange wrote:The weapons are there now. A legit pass-catching TE, a possession WR and a speed WR in your top two spots, a solid third in Kerley, a decent line (if not great in spots), and a good RB corps with both speed and power.

    They don't need to be a 35 point a game offense, but they do need to be productive, as does Geno. No more excuses.


    +1 , time to step up, play smart and be consistent. otherwise, time to move on.


    Has anyone seen the kid - cincinnati bearcats, QB, Gunner Kiel -

    2014 Season
    YDS TD INT
    1612 18 6
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    Post by SackExchange on Sat 18 Oct 2014 - 15:12

    There are some legit QBs in this draft class. Geno has to show he has what it takes, or a QB will be taken.

    Even if he develops here, they still may look at a QB, just not as early as they would have if Geno tanks.
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    Post by jamesfyo123 on Sat 18 Oct 2014 - 15:40

    soj wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:The weapons are there now. A legit pass-catching TE, a possession WR and a speed WR in your top two spots, a solid third in Kerley, a decent line (if not great in spots), and a good RB corps with both speed and power.

    They don't need to be a 35 point a game offense, but they do need to be productive, as does Geno. No more excuses.


    +1 , time to step up, play smart and be consistent.  otherwise, time to move on.


    Has anyone seen the kid - cincinnati bearcats, QB, Gunner Kiel -

    2014 Season
    YDS TD INT
    1612 18 6

    I'm going to see him play vs my Tulane Green Wave on Halloween!

    Hopefully he doesn't beat us too bad; we suck Bang Head

    EDIT: If he's back from his rib injury, that is
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    Post by McJet on Sun 19 Oct 2014 - 20:10

    I'll say this, it's not a pro Geno or anti Geno comment. Colts defense keyed on stopping the run and the Bengals passing game looked like sh t. It pretty amazing, i guess, what one game breaker can do for an offense. Lets hope Harvin can have the same type of effect on the Jets offense as a whole. Making sure defenses cannot stack the box. Having a player be accounted for every snap whether he getting the ball or not. Hopefully it works out for the Jets and Harvin and we as fans get a nice nine game ride where all players can be fully evaluated.
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    Post by football51 on Thu 23 Oct 2014 - 16:46

    Not a very positive picture here of Smith's future. Also, this comment from the link will make some go bananas, but it's what I've been trying to say in a few threads here.




    "Receivers don't make quarterbacks; quarterbacks make receivers," a longtime personnel executive said Wednesday, speaking on the condition of anonymity. "I don't think Geno can play, I don't care who you put around him. Yeah, [Harvin] will make him a little better, but I've seen enough of Geno. You can't saddle the next coach with another year of Geno."





    http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/45020/percy-harvin-can-help-but-only-geno-smith-can-save-geno-smith

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    Post by SackExchange on Thu 23 Oct 2014 - 18:43

    Well, we have nine games to find out.
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    Post by Superman55 on Thu 23 Oct 2014 - 19:46

    football51 wrote:Not a very positive picture here of Smith's future. Also, this comment from the link will make some go bananas, but it's what I've been trying to say in a few threads here.




    "Receivers don't make quarterbacks; quarterbacks make receivers," a longtime personnel executive said Wednesday, speaking on the condition of anonymity. "I don't think Geno can play, I don't care who you put around him. Yeah, [Harvin] will make him a little better, but I've seen enough of Geno. You can't saddle the next coach with another year of Geno."





    http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/45020/percy-harvin-can-help-but-only-geno-smith-can-save-geno-smith


    I dont disagree with that; however, no one is going to look good playing with Santoonio Holmes, David Nelson, Stephen Hill, and Clyde Gates - those were Geno's rookie year WRs...only 1 is still in the league one year later, and Holmes is hanging on by a thread.

    We had an entire roster of WRs that is currently out of the NFL 1 year later...that should say something, IMO...
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    Post by Superman55 on Thu 23 Oct 2014 - 19:47

    SackExchange wrote:Well, we have nine games to find out.


    And that's all he gets, IMO.
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    Post by SackExchange on Thu 23 Oct 2014 - 21:02

    Superman55 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:Well, we have nine games to find out.


    And that's all he gets, IMO.
    Unless he really steps up.
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    Post by Superman55 on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 6:26

    SackExchange wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:Well, we have nine games to find out.


    And that's all he gets, IMO.
    Unless he really steps up.

    You originally said "nine games to find out." That's what I meant by that's all he gets. After 9 games, he either has it, or we're looking for another QB to develop.
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    Post by DonMaynard on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 7:10

    Given the fact that there are , at least so far , no real QB blue chippers in this next draft class , it's not unthinkable , even if Geno does step his game up , to take a QB in round 2. I Expect to see either Bryce Petty or Mannion to be there for the picking. With Vick's age, is it unrealistic to go and get a good backup , who could ultimately replace Geno? Petty would be a solid choice in the second round in my opinion.
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    Post by GratefulJet on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 7:31

    Gotta agree with #13 here. Petty and Mannion are both intriguing for their college productivity. Neither has Geno's mobility but each comes with more of a traditional pocket passing background. Mannion has the better size and arm, so I would favor him, but he's the kind of QB prospect whose stock will rise as we approach the draft. Would love to get long Sean Mannion wherever he is projected to go right now--he's a lock to rise at least half a round before next April.

    In any case, even if Geno sticks next year, he needs to be pushed, and the team needs to have a legit alternative in case he is either injured or unable to develop past a certain point. I was a Geno backer until about the 2nd or 3rd game this year, but have jumped as far clear of that bandwagon as my legs would take me. I don't see the qualities of a franchise QB that you look for in him--poise, field vision, ability to lead his receivers, and killer instinct. Maybe he acquires these skills, but I am skeptical. So it would be wise to look QB in the 2nd round if guys like Petty and Mannion are there.
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    Post by SackExchange on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 9:16

    Superman55 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:Well, we have nine games to find out.


    And that's all he gets, IMO.
    Unless he really steps up.

    You originally said "nine games to find out."  That's what I meant by that's all he gets.  After 9 games, he either has it, or we're looking for another QB to develop.  
    Oh, yes. I get what you meant. My fault.

    You're right. His 9-game probationary period begins now.
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    Post by Superman55 on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 9:19

    SackExchange wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:
    Superman55 wrote:
    SackExchange wrote:Well, we have nine games to find out.


    And that's all he gets, IMO.
    Unless he really steps up.

    You originally said "nine games to find out."  That's what I meant by that's all he gets.  After 9 games, he either has it, or we're looking for another QB to develop.  
    Oh, yes. I get what you meant. My fault.

    You're right. His 9-game probationary period begins now.

    ...and ends after 9 games.  After that, if he looks as inconsistent as he does now, he goes into next year like Stephen Hill did this year, with a lot to prove and a full on QB competition where they rotate starts in the preseason and the best man wins after game 3.
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    Post by SackExchange on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 9:31

    You would have to think, the Jets will eventually hit on that QB. They've expended too many resources in trying. First rounders, second rounders, trades, free agent signings...the last really top notch QB they had was (arguably) Ken O'Brien, who was at or near the top of the league for some time. Even then, it was him instead of Marino.

    Drafting Nagle because Favre got swooped up the pick before. Boomer. O'Donnell.  Vinny (who had one or two top-level years with the Jets). Foley. Lucas. Chad (if he had only stayed healthy). Favre. Sanchez. Geno.

    The Jets either just miss out on elite guys, or they have guys who don't put it all together here, or guys who get hurt, or guys at the end of their careers, or just plain old busts. The Jets have not landed that true franchise QB at the beginning of his career since probably Namath.

    At some point, even a blind squirrel finds a nut.
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    Post by Superman55 on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 9:42

    SackExchange wrote:You would have to think, the Jets will eventually hit on that QB. They've expended too many resources in trying. First rounders, second rounders, trades, free agent signings...the last really top notch QB they had was (arguably) Ken O'Brien, who was at or near the top of the league for some time. Even then, it was him instead of Marino.

    Drafting Nagle because Favre got swooped up the pick before. Boomer. O'Donnell.  Vinny (who had one or two top-level years with the Jets). Foley. Lucas. Chad (if he had only stayed healthy). Favre. Sanchez. Geno.

    The Jets either just miss out on elite guys, or they have guys who don't put it all together here, or guys who get hurt, or guys at the end of their careers, or just plain old busts. The Jets have not landed that true franchise QB at the beginning of his career since probably Namath.

    At some point, even a blind squirrel finds a nut.

    Yeah, Cy gives me a hard time all of the time and says I'll never be happy until we win a super bowl.

    I don't agree. I wont be happy until we land a competent QB that can have us in the play-off hunt annually. He doesn't have to be Rodgers, Brees, or Brady - a Big Ben would be nice, Matt Ryan, Rivers, etc.

    Russell Wilson is no Aaron Rodgers, not by miles, but you could get excited about that brand of QB play.

    We do definitely need our guy to count on and it feels like we never have "that guy." When you go to Jets games, you never know what jersey you're going to see in the crowd (lots of 28 - Martin, 80 - Chrebet, with a few newer jerseys here and there, but one thing you dont see a lot of is QB jerseys in the stands unless it is Namath...).

    Hopefully that changes soon.
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    Post by SackExchange on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 9:52

    Don't need a Canton-bound guy, but a legit top-half starter for years, someone who can win a SB - though not necessarily on his own.

    A top 10 QB would make all the difference on this team...well, that and one more legit starting CB.
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    Post by Seaver on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 12:16

    here is what you have to watch with Geno.....do they trust him to throw intermediate routes that involve him recognizing coverages and moving the safety with his eyes? If all Harvin is going to be is a weapon at/near the line of scrimmage, then Geno will have proved nothing. I want to see back shoulder passes on the outside down the field. I want to see deep seam routes where the QB moves the safety off his target. I don't want Geno's college career repeating at the NFL level - it won't work. If Geno can't do more than one read in a timely fashion then he isn't the answer. It's all about decision making when it comes to being an NFL QB.
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    Post by football51 on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 14:09

    Similar to what you mentioned 55. Here's a more upbeat view of Smith.






    http://nyj.scout.com/story/1472659-it-s-geno-s-time-to-shine?s=65
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    Post by Seaver on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 14:33

    football51 wrote:Not a very positive picture here of Smith's future. Also, this comment from the link will make some go bananas, but it's what I've been trying to say in a few threads here.




    "Receivers don't make quarterbacks; quarterbacks make receivers," a longtime personnel executive said Wednesday, speaking on the condition of anonymity. "I don't think Geno can play, I don't care who you put around him. Yeah, [Harvin] will make him a little better, but I've seen enough of Geno. You can't saddle the next coach with another year of Geno."





    http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/45020/percy-harvin-can-help-but-only-geno-smith-can-save-geno-smith


    I'll tell you why that quote is true..........no matter the talent of the WR......the QB still has to make the correct read to find him. If your best WR is always your 1st read the defense can take that away. Reading through your progressions quickly to find second, third, etc options makes a true passing QB. Geno is a one read pony and thus if it is open, he looks good hitting it. Problems begin if 1st is not open. That's why you saw him take off so much in the NE game.....no 1st read...and the coaches have been on him to use the legs. They're coaching around his weakness.

    Key to properly evaluate Geno as a passer is see how many passes he completes where the ball is in the air +10 yards before caught. Throw out the quick stuff.
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    Post by Superman55 on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 14:53

    Seaver wrote:
    football51 wrote:Not a very positive picture here of Smith's future. Also, this comment from the link will make some go bananas, but it's what I've been trying to say in a few threads here.




    "Receivers don't make quarterbacks; quarterbacks make receivers," a longtime personnel executive said Wednesday, speaking on the condition of anonymity. "I don't think Geno can play, I don't care who you put around him. Yeah, [Harvin] will make him a little better, but I've seen enough of Geno. You can't saddle the next coach with another year of Geno."





    http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/45020/percy-harvin-can-help-but-only-geno-smith-can-save-geno-smith


    I'll tell you why that quote is true..........no matter the talent of the WR......the QB still has to make the correct read to find him.  If your best WR is always your 1st read the defense can take that away.  Reading through your progressions quickly to find second, third, etc options makes a true passing QB.  Geno is a one read pony and thus if it is open, he looks good hitting it.  Problems begin if 1st is not open.  That's why you saw him take off so much in the NE game.....no 1st read...and the coaches have been on him to use the legs.  They're coaching around his weakness.  

    Key to properly evaluate Geno as a passer is see how many passes he completes where the ball is in the air +10 yards before caught.  Throw out the quick stuff.  

    This isn't true.  if this was true, the person who leads our team in receptions, wouldn't lead our team in receptions...because the guy who leads our team in recepetions, is NEVER the first read...he's the 3rd...after our #2 and #3 team leading WRs.

    Even as a Geno fan, who hates some of his decisions, I can tell you he already progresses through his reads better than Kaepernick...ask Steve Young.

    http://www.ninersnation.com/2014/9/3/6096747/colin-kaepernick-49ers-quarterback-film-breakdown-reads

    Geno's issues have changed over the season.  He has greatly improved reading defenses and his footwork.  

    He is struggling now with - decision making, trusting what he sees, and delivering the ball on time.  The first few weeks, those issues were minimal, but his confidence is shot and he isn't trusting what he sees now, which is why he's running more, IMO.

    We've created a gun shy kid who became that way when Decker went down and he had a garbage can to work with playing WR at every spot.  Now he's gun shy and running around all of the time.  Blame Geno for that if you want, or blame the trash cans for not being better...I blame the guy who put trash cans at WR in the NFL and thought they would get open.

    When Bill Polian was grooming a young Peyton Manning, he gave him Faulk/James, Harrison, Wayne, and Dilger to work with, not trash cans...
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    Post by Seaver on Fri 24 Oct 2014 - 14:57

    he gave Manning that talent but Manning still made his share of mistakes the rookie season. The QB still has control over his own good/bad decisions. Geno is not good at them down the field 10+ yards. He's not a complete QB, thus he cannot be a franchise QB.

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